SucksWatch: the board statement

Over at Sucks, Crowsnest shows no signs of fatigue, as the Fram thread reaches 36 pages.

A few nuggets.


I wonder what percentage of the highly active Wikipedia community that inevitably dominates their instruments of self-government even understand what is meant by the following terms recently used by the Board…..

* toxic behaviors
* safe and respectful environment
* diverse voices

Is that really what they want to offer training on? I know Wikipedia is meant to be for everyone, but come on, anyone who needs training to understand these terms and how they relate to Wikipedia governance, they’re really not going to be capable of being an effective Administrator.

It is clear, training is not the answer. The problem, is wiki has far too many Administrators, and a good few users even higher up the food chain, who know precisely what these words mean, they just have no real interest in seeing them as strategic priorities.


Most of the wiki users and special the high productive are autistic as hell. And there they recruit there sysops and Arbs out of.

You can’t learn a elephant figure skating, it is again insane. It’s the same if I hire for my next project a bunch of color blind painters and if the mess everything up say I will train them.

This is not just hyperbole, we have highly placed volunteers (cough, Seraphimblade, aka Todd Allen cough), who are in charge of making and interpreting policy, who have actually been diagnosed with autism, Aspergers, or who claim to be “on the spectrum”.

Maybe it’s time to go back and read WP:Competence is required, in the light of Fram and his enablers.


Wiki update – 4th of July edition

[Note: The original Fram article is at You rang? The Fram thing…. Additional Framage at Fram category, or by internal search]

Everything has been happening fast in the Wikilandia. For those who don’t have a lot of time to pour over the noticeboards, here are some highlights.

The Fram ban

Everything is at WP:FRAM, including related statements from elsewhere



Flag controversy

I kind of like the Betsy Ross flag. It was done by women and slaves together,  putting a lie to the idea that our history and our independence was only a product of the rich white men.

Corbett at AE

Blocked for a month.  Thank you, Kirill.

Why is this guy even still editing?

More than even Fae, with his bondage fetish, Corbett seems to go out of his way to seek punishment. And Wikipedia’s “governance” system is tailor-made to keep punishing him over and over and over again, without ever putting him out of his misery. This reminds me of the story of the baby born prematurely who was put in intensive care, and had nurses thumping on his back with tiny toothbrushes to keep the lungs clear. Later, in childhood, the baby developed behavior problems and took every chance to do something that would result in getting hit, so as to reproduce that earlier pre-memory experience. Something profound must have happened to this Corbett guy, something that even he doesn’t remember. Or maybe sometimes kids take on responsibly for the stuff going on around them and think it’s all their fault, when it isn’t. Children often to not have a clear idea of boundaries, they do not understand they are not the same person as their parents, and have a separate existence –they think they are responsible for what someone else does, and end up in a guilt and punishment-seeking cycle of self-destruction.  It is the problem of the adults to solve the adult problems and not put them as a burden on their children.


I have been hearing for some time now that Beestra was no longer an admin, but it didn’t come true until today.  And not without pissing and moaning about Katherine and the board, and pinging several board members.  But board member Pundit and former admin Boing! said Zebedee were unable to cajole him, and he is gone. Given his antics with his bot, he could very well have been Fram’s next target when the ban expires.

Before he left, he added Breitbart to the whitelist, using a tool only available to admins, specifically the article by The Devil’s Advocate that makes so many unsupported accusations about Laura Hale, and probably the one that led to her vanishing her account.

In spite of a prominent “Strike” message on his talk page, the error-prone Beetstra has dived right in at arbcom, micromanaging their process and misconfiguring a ping – having misspelled SilkTork’s user name, he merely corrects it without adding a new timestamp, which a ping must have in order to work.

Jehochman’s arbcom request targeting WMF staff

Advertising sales agent Jehochman

After his abortive attempt to build a case against Laura Hale, the smarmy Jehochman has filed a case request naming both Jan Essfeldt and Katherine Maher as “parties”.  On Katherine’s talk page, Jehochman somewhat disingenuously mansplains to her that “Perhaps you will enjoy taking a close look at how the arbitration process works.” and admonishes her to “Please comment only in your own section.” What, are there no arbcom clerks about?  Surely someone has developed a template to short-circuit this type of officiously condescending tripe.  But he is probably too busy backchanneling with Bishonen and Worm that Turned.

What he fails to mention is that naming her and Jan as parties means Jehochman has placed them in a position where they can be sanctioned by arbcom, as well as Fram, using their infamous “boomerang”, placing arbcom in a position over the board of directors. Let’s see if the arbcom is willing to pick up that hot potato.

It is equally awkward that this wannabe Perry Mason has filed his show trial arbcom case request to conflict with the scheduled July 3 conference call between the WMF and arbcom.

In a nutshell, some of us want to edit, others want to use Wikipedia for dramah-dramah.  Guess who is winning.

These guys droning on

“It was exhausting to try to listen for hours on end to these guys droning on.”
– Sue Montgomery, Montreal

So, taking a look at…

…what do you see?

Yup, sausagefest.


And they are not exactly Wikipedia’s best and brightest either.

Once again, we can turn to Canada for a solution (via Metafilter).

Sue Montgomery (red link), mayor of the Côte-des-Neiges—Notre-Dame-de-Grâce borough, this week announced she is knitting during council meetings to help her concentrate and to demonstrate that men speak more than women at the meetings.

Montgomery knits in red when men speak and in green when women do. So far, she has 15 inches of scarf, 80 per cent of it red.

The council has 31 women and 34 men. According to Montgomery:

“My experience is that men tend to use up all the time allotted to them. They repeat everything several ways even though they’ve made their point. They like the sound of their own voices. Women tend to stand up, make their point and sit down.”

I’m seeing a way here to improve Wikipedia’s dramah boards…

And with number of admin resignations at WP:BN, maybe it’s time to start adding some  different kinds of admins: article deletion admins, civility admins, etc,


Solomon, Sheba, and dividing the baby

23 Then the king said, “The one says, ‘This is my son that is alive, and your son is dead’; while the other says, ‘Not so! Your son is dead, and my son is the living one.’” 24 So the king said, “Bring me a sword,” and they brought a sword before the king. 25 The king said, “Divide the living boy in two; then give half to the one, and half to the other.” 26 But the woman whose son was alive said to the king—because compassion for her son burned within her—“Please, my lord, give her the living boy; certainly do not kill him!” The other said, “It shall be neither mine nor yours; divide it.” 27 Then the king responded: “Give the first woman the living boy; do not kill him. She is his mother.” 28 All Israel heard of the judgment that the king had rendered; and they stood in awe of the king, because they perceived that the wisdom of God was in him, to execute justice. — 1 Kings 3:23-28

As the Fram dispute continues on Wikipedia, and the (white, male) leadership alternately pat each other on the back and discuss ways to sabotage the Project, I am reminded of the story of the Judgment of Solomon.

Two women dispute over a baby. Solomon proposes to cut the baby in half,  then awards the baby to the woman to objects to the baby’s death. For this, (and okay, a few others, like letting the bee in to test for the fake flower, and the clavicula salomon of medieval grimoires for imprisoning demons),  Solomon gets credit for great wisdom.

But according to a description on Commons on theTripartite Mahzor manuscript, that decorates the frontispiece to the Song of Songs, there is a tradition that the Queen of Sheba was with Solomon on that day, and it was she who advised him on the judgment.

The story of Sheba’s visit to Solomon has been widely told, and from the standpoint of several cultures. In the Old Testament book Kings 1 and Chronicles 2, it is a meeting between heads of state, rather than a royal marriage or romance. But others attribute the subject of the Song of Solomon as Sheba. In Islam, Sheba is Bilqis. In Ethiopia, where Solomon is said to have fathered the royal line of emperors, she is Makeda. In Persia, Sheba is the daughter of a Chinese king and a peri, a magical being.

Here are a few representations of the Judgement of Solomon — or of Sheba, as the case may be.



And here are a couple of peris, just for good measure.



All FRAM all the time

After 20-odd pages of cruft on the ongoing Fram dude-bro hissy-fit, Crowsnest, over at Sucks, has finally started hitting his stride, tracking everything from resignations of admins (who quite frankly have not been particularly active lately), to the inevitable upcoming Signpost coverage.  If you have nothing constructive to do with your time, you might want to check out the ongoing rant.

A sample:

crow rants on Fram

This extraordinary statement advocating intentional disruption might be something you expect to find coming from the hasten-the-day crowd, instead it is from a powerful insider afraid of losing his status and privilege.

… On a specified date, the editors who agree to the proposal will begin to report every violation of the terms of use to Trust & Safety. And a lot of things are: Vandalism is against the TOU. Copyright violations are against the TOU. BLP violations, spamming/advertising, suspected undisclosed paid editing, block or ban evasion? All a TOU violation. Send them a report each and every time one of those things happens. Even if it’s already been handled by someone not participating, make sure they get a report, so T&S can make sure the rubes didn’t screw it up. I say we let T&S handle all of it, and see just how much work the volunteers who have kept this project running for nearly two decades deal with every day. If they think they can do it better than we do, let’s send them a message: Prove it. Seraphimblade Talk to me 02:26, 24 June 2019 (UTC)

Todd Allen (Seraphimblade): “I’m autistic myself.”

Seraphimblade (Todd Allen) is either a former or current arbitrator, I forget which. This is extraordinary, grown men charged with protecting the project are now essentially advocating vandalism against it if they can’t run it as their own private brotopia. Crow quotes him from the mailing list here, un-ironically protesting “secret Star Chamber-style proceedings, where apparently even the accused is not permitted to know all the evidence against them” : Can you say “honeypot“?

Another interesting viewpoint comes from Boing said Zebedee, someone who is both deeply embedded in Manchester politics but has carved out his own niche:

“Whatever might happen in the coming days and weeks, it remains a fact that we are in the midst of a governance change and a shift in the balance of power….Should I ever consider re-applying to become an administrator, it would not be until the current power shift is complete, until the new rules and enforcement regime are finalized and made clear, and until I see the new enforcement structure working sufficiently well and sufficiently fairly to consider becoming a part of it…. “

Two comments on that, (1) yes I think “shift of power” is about right, it is a realistic evaluation and (2) this is how it has *always* been for women. But when it happens to men, they down the tools and walk away, muttering “fairness”.  And so far, none of them has been mocked as a “social justice warrior”, or told to develop a “tougher skin” or not to be such a “special snowflake”.  Shall we have no more of those head-scratching “why don’t women edit Wikipedia” articles?

[Note: the above statement by an identifiable person (Todd Allen) is so extraordinary, I have gone looking for the diff which Crow has neglected to provide us with.  Here ya go: ]


Oh wow, just….speechless, User:Seraphimblade:

“…Especially serious are the allegations that the WMF sanctioned someone at least in part because he stood close to people to compensate for a hearing impairment, and mistreated people who had autism. (The latter especially hits home; I’m autistic myself.) …”

This is who the brotopia cult wants to make judgments on behalf of Wikipedia.

Link: ]

[Another update]

lots of revelations of autism/spectrum disorders on this recently archived thread, this is amazing:

spectrum disorder screenshots

*As someone who has a [[Autism spectrum|spectrum]] [[Asperger Syndrome|disorder]] this is absolutely appalling for me, and demonstrates that T&S [[WP:Our social policies are not a suicide pact|aren’t trustworthy for their role]]. Being able to separate a legitimate complaint from a spurious one should be a ”requirement” for that position. —[[User:Jéské Couriano|A little blue Bori]] [[User talk:Jéské Couriano|v^_^v]] [[Special:Contributions/Jéské Couriano|Bori!]] 19:57, 19 June 2019 (UTC)
** As someone who has both hearing loss *and* an autism spectrum disorder, I share your feelings. That’s really gross on behalf of the WMF if true. [[User:Rockstone35|Rockstone]][[User talk:Rockstone35|talk to me!]] 20:34, 19 June 2019 (UTC)

The Dunning–Kruger is strong with this one.

Katherine frames the issue

Who wants to work in a place subject to denigration and verbal abuse? -Katherine Maher

This tweet will age well.

“Denigration and verbal abuse”, eh.

It has been claimed at Elsewhere that Katherine has not publicly addressed the Fram thing.

O rly?

I think she just did.

Oh wait, this is about workforce and U.S. politics after all….

Isn’t it?

This other tweet aged pretty well too.

“Locker room values”, lol.

Locker room values, indeed.

But if you remember, that one wasn’t really about the San Diego conference either, #lockerroomvalues was about Trump’s statement that he can “grab women by the pussy” any time he wants, because he is so rich they don’t dare complain.  Trump tried to excuse it by calling it “locker room talk”.

Oh dear, is the “shrinking breastaurant” doing poorly?  Is “locker room values” a poor business model?  Tsk, tsk.

It’s amazing how many lessons for Wikipedia can be taken from the foibles of the Trump administration.

T&S flowchart

Here is the flowchart the Trust and Safety says they use to determine office actions.

Looks like they forgot to add a few sections, though.

For instance “Does the person being harassed have a penis?” (Oh come on, you knew I was going to say that.)

Harassed person has penis?
No ======> take no action
Yes ======> go to next step

I think they are also leaving out how many times they actually do secretly go to arbcom and arbcom turns them down.

Harassed person has penis?
No ====> humbly ask arbcom to do something, arbcom will automatically refuse, unless penis
Arbcom refuses to take any action ====> WMF explains to harassed person, and surrounding persons who have witnessed the harassment, that they can not do anything about it, because arbcom

Yeah, that’s more like how it really is.

(And that’s why it can’t be Laura Hale, they just threw her to the wolves as a red herring. Have they not already said they would not identify the person(s) making the report?  Obviously she is just one of the previous things Fram was warned about. And what has happened to her as a result of this office action is the poster child case for keeping these things private.)